b5_revisited | "Infection" discussion [spoilers]

I think it might have been trying to keep a low profile before Clark's days because it was part of his 'conspiracy'. Once he was in charge it starts advertising (as seen in And Now for a Word?) and generally more high-profile.

As someone with an archaeology degree, I had a similar response!

The episode also features the first appearance of a JMS stock-in-trade, the annoying reporter (still featured in Lost Tales.) I have to say this bothers me in retrospect

Yeah - that caught my eye this time through as well. It's not that I *necessarily* disagree with any given portrayal, but the cumulative effect... journalists and archaeologists are always evil? *g* I particularly disliked the incident in the Lost Tales, because that was just unnecessarily petty. JMS obviously has some... issues with journalism, which is a shame, because, as you say, it's important, and it could have added an interesting extra layer to the show.

Wiki says JMS worked as a journalist himself in addition to his other jobs (150 articles), which makes it even odder.

Incident in the Lost Tales: oh yes. That didn't make Sheridan look funny but made him look acting like a jerk.

Archaeologist-wise, though, he did try to break the pattern with Max who is a company man out for money but also capable of doing the right thing in a pinch.

Lastly: back in the day the lesson I drew from this episode was that if an episode had no aliens as main characters, just the human staff, I was less likely to enjoy it...

I do believe there was a later episode where Garibaldi was handling a case of a "crazy person" {I think was it... DUST, no probably not?}, it's been a while. The man was having nightmares and a inferior officer made a comment about how crazy the guy was and something offensive or other. Garibaldi asked the inferior officer if he was drafted in the war and he replied, "I missed it."

Garibaldi goes on to saying that the crazy guy didn't miss it---inferior officer asks how he knew, and Garibaldi replies that he's had the same nightmares? So possibly? I think Garibaldi seemed to be involved? To what extent is never really known.

I could be completely off. But I distinctly remember this episode.

Garibaldi's speech to Sinclair about the unnacceptable risks he takes is very timely.

This really impressed me first time round - it was more than a speech between character, it was a statement about the series itself. In e.g. Star Trek, command staff happily take totally unacceptable risks, and people rarely bat an eyelid. Garibaldi, on the other hand, implies that he is far from the only one who has noticed, and he is worried.

And of course, the "worth living for" theme is going to be picked up again later!

Oh, hey, new 'B5'! I had skipped this on my first time through, because various people had told me it was inessential -- they *obviously* weren't Sheridan/Garibaldi shippers, because I adored their interactions here. Good Franklin episode too. I can see that the sci-fi plot is derivative and a little muddled, and action!Sinclair was a little odd and unexpected. Still, this was a really entertaining episode.

Grey 17 was a bit like TKO, half good (well, all right anyway) and half highly fast-forwardable rubbish.
Infection could happily be reduced to the last 10 minutes or so, everything worth saying is said in those, and the rest isn't even entertaining.

Apparently jms once said that he wished the episode would go away and never come back (can't remember the exact words)...

That was a *great* moment and I wish I hadn't skipped this ep the first time around, because it was an interesting insight into Sinclair's character and into their friendship. I'm not sure how well it bears out in JS's later characterization but now I'll know to look for it.

Also, I want Michael Garibaldi to be my BFF, now and forever.

- Hey, it’s the floating cameras from ‘The Gathering’! Do they ever reappear?

Oh, yes :-)

BTW, anyone else notice Nightwatch at the end?

By and large, the media are represented in a "how dare they bother and crtisize our heroes?" fashion, when we, the viewers, know so much better. And that irritates me.

Yeah, I have to say this isn't that unusual in American shows/movies of the time, but it is disappointing in the context of what's a visionary show in many other ways. I think, as you've said, the 'West Wing' has changed that a bit -- together with events of the last decade that make some people sit up and say, 'hey maybe an activist independent media would be a *good thing to have*. But in general, in the 80s & 90s, if media weren't specifically set up as the crusading heroes, they were generally shown as dumb and/or evil.

Looked it up in my season 2---it's The Long Dark.

Ha, yes! It could be expunged and we'd lose nothing. Definitely a filler. I still wasn't quite as bored as I was in the A stories of TKO and Grey 17.

I really must make a B5 icon.

Or the s2 interview with Delenn - how dare the nasty reporter make Delenn cry! Except, of course, this is the same Delenn who goes head to head with Neroon, Shadows, Drakhs etc without crying, and intimidates the hell out of everyone when she wants to, so this is just cheap emotional manipulativeness on the writing's part.

In this one instance, I have to say that I had thought that was foreshadowing Delenn's own guilt about her role in the genesis of the Earth/Minbari war as elaborated upon in "Atonement."

Otherwise, I agree that the show could have been more responsible about how it portrayed certain professions. Wait until we get to "A View From the Gallery."

Most of my reactions to this episode are pretty much the same as most of the others who have posted here; it's not really that great an example of Babylon 5, but it does have some interesting concepts floating around it and an excellent character moment. Indeed, it is a testament to the show that Garibaldi would confront Sinclair about his seeming death wish so early in its run. Until that moment I just accepted Sinclair's heroics because he was the lead in the show and that sort of thing is what leads do, but this conversation hinted at something much more complex than that, and also signifies a difference in the way the commander would be treated.

I felt that the idea of a device that eliminates based on ideological differences was actually pretty interesting, but it was basically shoehorned into your standard "Frankenstein monster" plot (complete with a catchphrase). While Franklin does barely link it into some of the larger story arcs that are to come, too much of his time is spent on the relatively dull issue of Hendricks taking shortcuts.

J.M.S. says that this was his first script of the series proper, and I can't help but feel that the better elements of the story would have been more effectively exploited later on. The reporter, for example, serves absolutely no purpose whatsoever, she's just a subplot for the sake of a subplot.

I did enjoy Christopher Franke's score much more than I did for his work on "Born To the Purple" (which was otherwise a much superior episode).

That's Sinclair/Garibaldi, oh shipper, and I still don't feel guilty for telling you to skip that one on your original run. I was tring to get you hooked!

Dammit, I don't get those guys mixed up but I do mix up their names! I blame JMS and his fixation with his own initials!

And yes, I do get the reasoning -- I was eager to get to the big arc stuff that I'd been hearing all about (and managed to stay almost totally unspoiled for, so yay for that). And it is cool that I'll be able to see some things for the first time, on this rewatch, and have them mean more.

I think, as you've said, the 'West Wing' has changed that a bit -- together with events of the last decade that make some people sit up and say, 'hey maybe an activist independent media would be a *good thing to have*

I was thinking of that, too. Once you've lived through the era of "embedded" journalism, it might change some perspective.

In e.g. Star Trek, command staff happily take totally unacceptable risks, and people rarely bat an eyelid.

And of course when B5 was on, there were two Star Trek series on the go, I think (STtNG was just ending but DS9 was relatively new, as I recall), so it came across to me at the time as JMS saying, "We are not doing what they do."

cameras - sorry missed your note yesterday:

They definitely re-appear in season 4 "The Illusion of Truth", but I'm fairely sure they are also in " And Now for a Word" (season 2).

In the Lost Tales, Sheridan comments on their absence.

Wiki says JMS worked as a journalist himself in addition to his other jobs (150 articles), which makes it even odder.

Not necessarily - he'll also have known a lot of inside dirt.

I know people who deal with sensitve issues, and all of them have had bad experiences with the media.

I think part of what jms is doing is not slagging off journalists as such, but highlighting the power of the media. And unfortunately nobody ever notices that when (if?) it is used to do good.

To quote

4thofeleven from above: The reporter here serves no purpose to the story other than to show up, be unlikable, and get in the way... How dare she try and claim the people have 'a right to know' about the Ikaran weapon's attacks? Next she'll be claiming the people have a right to know about who funded the excavation of the weapon, or what happened to it after the episode!

I.e. we have the presentation of the reporter in a bad light when in fact she was doing her job. And that's a pattern on this show. Again, I don't mean an episode like The Illusion of Truth where the media is already under Clark's control, but before, and after.

And unfortunately nobody ever notices that when (if?) it is used to do good.

I'd say Watergate has burned itself into the public consciousness as a prime example of the power of the media used for good in real life. In my own country, Germany, one major incident in the early 60s was when the secretary of state had a reporter and an editor arrested in Spain (where they were vacationing) for a story the magazine Der Spiegel had printed. This, the "Spiegel Affair", ended with the secretary of state dismissed (and the journalist freed, of course), and was celebrated as a victory for the relatively young post WWII democracy.

Also, Western media today tends to be very heavily slanted towards certain ideological perspectives. Now, there's no such thing as truly objective; everyone has a point of view, and in the case of journalists it influences both what stories they search out and how they tell them. Certainly, there are many journalists whose perspectives don't fit the normal politics/ideology for the media, but overall there's a definite slant. (It's why it's so important to get multiple points of view--no matter how fair and balanced and objective you try to be, no one can truly be objective.) Someone with a different perspective who tried to go against the grain (as JMS probably found himself) might not have had a very good experience, depending on where and when he was working in the field.

But I think the problem, at least with this particular episode, is that there's no indication that the journalist has any particular slant or bias or insidious agenda or anything like that. The very fact that she wants to do a story on B5 is taken as evidence she's an annoyance.

Yeah. I was speaking of a reason JMS might be biased against reporters even given that he was one, and not referring to this episode's reporter specifically. Sorry for being unclear!

"Infection" discussion [spoilers]

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