"A Voice in the Wilderness" discussion [spoilers]

[ruuger]

This is the discussion post for the episodes 1X18 and 1x19, "A Voice in the Wilderness", Part 1 and Part 2. Spoilers for the whole of the series, including the spin-offs and tie-ins, are allowed here so newbies beware.

Summary:

Delenn has a visit from an old friend, Garibaldi is troubled by the news from Mars, and there is mysterious seismic activity on Epsilon 3.

Extra reading:

The article for "A Voice in the Wilderness". Part 1 and Part 2 at Lurker's Guide.

Comments

[dqbunny.livejournal.com]

I saw "A Voice in the Wilderness" after seeing seasons 3 and 4, and it really laid the seeds for the excellent episodes we got in those seasons. My single favorite part was Londo and Delenn working together to get Draal onto Epsilon 3 and into the Great Machine. The entire storyline with Delenn and Draal was touching to begin with, especially since I do know where Draal is coming from with trying to find your place in life as you get older.

You also have Londo, who still hasn't moved beyond the point of no return in his life. He wants to do great things, and still remain relevant as well and is offered that chance by Draal. Of course, that's like dangling the golden ticket in front of Londo and he grabs it and you really get a good chance to see how unselfish Londo can be. These two episodes truly feature some of the best scenes for Londo Mollari, especially early on in the series, and it's this Londo I miss terribly by season 5.

Some of the best lines:

LONDO: Physics tells us that for every action, there must be an equal and opposite reaction. They hate us, we hate them, they hate us back. And so, here we are, victims of mathematics!

LONDO: Now, landing thrusters, landing thrusters. If I were a landing thruster, which one of these would I be?

And, of course, there is the infamous ...

IVANOVA: Ambassador. Do you really want to know what's going on down there right now?
LONDO: Yes! Absolutely!
IVANOVA: Boom! Boom-boom-boom! Boom-boom! BOOM! Have a nice day!

Then there's Londo doing the Hokey-Pokey. ^_^

[selenak.livejournal.com]

The first time I saw these episodes was directly after the pilot, because for some reason the pilot and this two-parter were released on video in Germany before the actual first season was shown on tv! Which is why I got to meet Ivanova this way. Needless to say, she made an impression. :)

It has what is probably my favourite scene between Londo and Garibaldi, which works on several levels. On the one hand, it epitomizes their early friendship, that Londo genuinenly likes Garibaldi (and vice versa) and for all his flamboyance is able to spot Garibaldi's distress easily. On the other hand, if you know the overall show, especially The very long night of Londo Mollari in season 5, you know that Londo is also lying in his story about his first wife, the dancer. He gives the story a funny ending (the woman he fell for ends up the a harridan the next morning, he regrets the marriage, etc.), making it an anecdote to be smiled at and himself a comic character; it's not before we're in Londo's own head, when he's talking to "Sheridan", that we find out what actually happened was that he genuinenly loved her and that his family made him choose between them and divorce her as unsuitable for a Mollari; the first time Londo chooses status and ambition over what he felt was the right thing to do. "I died for the first time that day, as I looked in her eyes". Now you could argue he picks a different ending because the reason for the story is after all to cheer up Garibaldi, but in truth I think it's the story Londo has been telling himself ever since, and especially relatively soon after Adira (also a dancer, like the nameless woman of his past), he's clinging to it.

Londo being chosen along with Draal and Sinclair by the great machine as a possible candidate is fascinating, too. The foreshadowing works for Sinclair - he will end up doing something similar to Draal, in a way, by becoming Valen, giving up his human present and all his connections there, returning to the past to save the Minbari. At first glance Londo with his ambitions and the choices he's about to make (again) seems a less likely candidate... until you remember how it all ends (and that beyond personal ambition, Londo's primary motivation was love for his people). Because Londo accepting the Keeper and the remainder of his life in hell, with a parasite instead of a voluntary symbiosis a la Draal & the great machine, is again a living sacrifice, so save Centauri Prime and everyone on it from being destroyed by the Drakh.

The Mars riots: as has been said in other reviews this season, the first season really shows that long before Clark becomes President, the Earth Alliance has serious internal troubles.

Lise Hampton who gets introduced here was widely disliked during first broadcast as I recall. Personally, I have no opinion one way or the other (I found her neither objectionable nor very interesting), but Garibaldi's attachment to her gets quite firmly established here, and considering it will become important in overall continuity, that's good world building.

[4thofeleven.livejournal.com]

Like everyone else has said, I found the most interesting part of this episode to be Londo. The rest all feels a bit too much like pieces being moved into position – important, certainly, but not actually that entertaining to watch. I’m also wondering if JMS was having a little trouble adjusting to writing a two-parter – part one is incredibly slow paced, and the episode seems to end just as the plot actually gets moving. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, but there’s a few things introduced in part two that really could have done with some fleshing out – the captain of the Hyperion could have done with a bit more depth than just ‘arrogant aggressive dick’ – and it seems to me there’s an interesting story to be told about the renegade aliens. I think it’d be a stronger episode if both had been introduced a little earlier, probably at the expense of some of the scenes dealing with the science team’s surveys of the planet.

The Londo scenes, meanwhile, are great. Not going to repeat what selenak said, but I agree, it’s a wonderful bit of less than obvious foreshadowing about Londo’s character for him to be one of the three individuals Varn contacted.

And the Mars riots – well, again we’re reminded that the Earth Alliance is not a shiny happy Federation. It’d be interesting to know just how big the Free Mars movement was a this stage – enough to cause serious problems, certainly, but how many Martians were demanding full independence before Clark forced the issue?

Other notes:

- The ISN report mentions in passing “increasing questions being raised about the cost of maintaining a presence in space.”, which was also brought up at the end of “Infection”. It’s interesting that Earth – apparently one of the larger powers, with at least one sizable extra-solar colony on Proxima 3, and a history of involvement in alien conflicts, is still somewhat sceptical about whether space travel is actually worth it. From an economic point of view, this is actually somewhat understandable – what does Mars, for example, produce that justifies the cost of colonisation? Not something that normally comes up, even as a background detail, in science fiction, which tend to assume that colonising space is automatically a worthwhile endeavour.

- Alright, I realise the Minbari are, for all intents and purposes, Tolkien’s elves in space. That’s fine, that’s a common enough archetype in science fiction. But you’re meant to be a bit more subtle than having members of that species discussing how they have been called to the sea…

- I think this is one of the few episodes where Delenn and Londo get any significant time together. Man, it’s weird watching B5 ambassadors being… diplomatic to each other!

- Not directly referenced here, but it’s always vaguely amused me how B5 handles first contact situations. It’s rather cleverly set up to have it that regulations require a command-level officer, and to have it be a response to the disastrous first contact with the Minbari, so that the old trope of the captain leading the away team personally is completely justified within the setting. Of course, that’s a Star Trek trope, not one that comes up particularly often in B5, so after setting up the justification so well, the show ends up only having a couple of first contact situations occur…

- Man, the Hyperion is an ugly ship – even by the low standards of the Earth Alliance.

- I like the attention to detail that Londo’s shuttle, though clearly the same basic design as the other shuttles seen, has a far more ornate interior, as benefits his rank.

- Lise Hampton (-Edgars-Garibaldi-Nahasapeemapetilon) is, I will admit, not one of my favourite characters. I don’t dislike her – that’s rather the problem… she’s never interesting enough to devote any attention to either way. I do like that she’s set up here and in “Babylon Squared”, so she’s an established character when Garibaldi runs into her again – what, two and a half years from now? I do wonder why it was decided to have her divorce and then get married again in the intervening time...

[selenak.livejournal.com]

I think this is one of the few episodes where Delenn and Londo get any significant time together.

You're right, it doesn't happen often, which I always found slightly frustrating because the scenes they do share tend to rock. (The one where she tries to invite him to her ceremony of renewal comes to mind, Londo's vision of Delenn-the-relentless-seer-of-truths in his dream world, and of course the hug.) Also because they provide parallels and contrasts in their lives which fascinate me. Both Londo and Delenn are responsible for a ruthless war which employed genocidal tactics at times. Both Londo and Delenn, when they get a last minute chance to put an end to it by fate handing them an enemy (Delenn picks a pilot to be interrogated and it's Sinclair, G'Kar gets captured and delivered to Cartagia's court) take it, but that doesn't negate their original guilt. Both Londo and Delenn end up in an intense personal relationship with a former enemy (G'Kar and Sheridan). But Delenn's guilt is something only she and later Lennier know about; Londo's guilt is something which to a large extent most people know about, though just how deeply he was involved with Morden and how this kickstarted the Narn/Centauri war is something only Vir and, post-Dust-to-Dust, G'Kar know.

[widsidh.livejournal.com]

I agree with most of what 's been said already, so just a quick thought.

While it is interesting that Londo is chosen, apparently for his willingness to sacrifice himself, I find it far more interesting that Delenn, who is being built up as quite a spiritual person and (despite recent revelations) good-guy type figure, is not.

In the light of later events, it is not all taht surprising, but it is another subtle piece of character building of the type we are subsequently led to (temporarily forget) - just for it all to resurface after the Shadow War.

ANd on a different subject - some fantastic Ivanova lines too - I particularly like the "just kiding about the god part" bit!

[kel-1970.livejournal.com]

Man, the Hyperion is an ugly ship – even by the low standards of the Earth Alliance.

Yeah, and it doesn't even have any spinny parts, so they're floating in zero-G the whole time. No wonder Ellis Pierce is so cranky!

[kel-1970.livejournal.com]

Not too much to add to the gestalt, so just a few notes:
--Some comments of Delenn's that I particularly liked in this one include her distinction between "unreasonable" and "angry" when discussing G'Kar with Londo, and her description of Humans as "a mass of contradictions." Just you wait, hon, you ain't seen nothin' yet.

--When Sinclair tells Pierce of the (fictitious) need for a jamming device, and Pierce asks why he wasn't told about this, Sinclair's response, "You didn't ask," is Very Minbari.

--We get to see some nice positive aspects of Londo, which are increasingly few and far betweem in later seasons.

--Apparently, Draal taught Delenn that "a half truth is the worst kind of lie." Seems like she likes to ignore this one, from time to time.

--The planet has a Prime Directive!

--If I suddenly saw an image appear before me of an alien saying "Help me," I would probably tell someone. This falls under the "Don't you people watch the show?" category of nitpick, in which characters do (or don't do) things that anyone watching the show knows are a mistake.

--Another bit of the "sneaky Delenn" seen here. Someone without a sneaky side probably would not have participated in the little outing she and Londo took Draal on, and certainly wouldn't have busted Varn out of sickbay. Whoops, wrong show - I mean medlab.

--At the end of part II, when Garibaldi is told "Sinclair's destiny lies elsewhere," why didn't that statement raise Garibaldi's eminently raisable eyebrows even a little?

[lazulidragon.livejournal.com]

Huh, actually forgot this was a two-parter. It's probably a good thing we don't have many of those, if the length and complexity of the "Previously On..." part is anything to go by (or maybe I just haven't been watching enough TV recently).

That particular design of cruiser never shows up again, does it? I'm assuming it's supposed to be an old model, since there's no spinning gravity parts and everyone's strapped into their seats, as with Narn ships.

I found it sort of amusing that Delenn and Draal were just going to barge right into the sealed-off part of medlab, without permission, while Franklin was in there. And even after he's told them off, they just wait until his back is turned and come in anyway. I half expected him to react with even more indignation, but the patient is obviously more important to him.

Speaking of Draal, I love him! He had such a great dynamic with Delenn, too, very sweet. I'm glad his mid-life crisis worked out for him, as it were.

By the end of the series I had a kind of soft spot for Lise, not sure why. Don't really have any feeling one way or the other about her here, though.

I wonder what sort of diversion Londo and Delenn might have set up? I'm imagining poor Vir getting dragged into it somehow, and then dealing with the aftermath, as per usual. I would think he'd have very strong feelings about the ambassador up and running off to a suddenly very dangerous planet, though.

Where were Zathras and company during all this, do you think? Surely they would have been taking care of some part of the machine, even while it was going crazy. At the least, I would have thought they'd want to tidy up the bodies in the lazer trap thing!

Did Corwin-who-is-still-yet-to-be-named-Corwin get a haircut, or is it just me?

Annnnd now Psi Corps knows that Garibaldi's hacked into at least some of their classified information. All things considered, probably not a good thing for him. They must keep their most sensitive stuff elsewhere, though, if Garibaldi never stubled across anything more suspect than training facilities.

I love the look on Sinclair's face when he tells Londo "no."

All Garibaldi's magic trick is missing is a pencil lol

[imhilien.livejournal.com]

I liked this two-part show. Up to now it was easy to take the planet B5 was orbiting for granted until it became 'active'. If B5 needed to be evacuated, it could have got messy...

I did like the character of Draal, and his quest for something meaningful at the end of his life.

I appreciate how Londo tried to cheer Garibaldi up.

A recurring theme starts from this episode methinks - people plugged into machines, although there are benefits in this case (knowledge, enhanced life, etc).

Lots of drama going on at Mars.

Some great lines: (I think I've remembered them properly)

Garibaldi (to Londo) - "If you kiss my head, I'll break your arm."

Garibaldi - "The planet we're parked beside is about to go up like a Roman candle - what am I supposed to do, arrest it?"

Ivanova (about EA captain) "Worst case of testosterone poisoning I've ever seen."

[4thofeleven.livejournal.com]

Hmm - now that you mention it, the Great Machine caretaker does seem like a more symbiotic version of the Shadow ship's setup. And the planet does seem to use the same sort of big-ass slicing laser to take out the renegade ship that Shadow ships use... Coincidence, or did the original builders of the Machine get their tech from the Shadows, either directly or through reverse engineering?

I'd rather like it if it was based off Shadow designs, just because it bugged me that later episodes would treat Shadow tech as *inherently* corrupting, while Vorlon technology is treated as being totally safe to incorporate into new ISA designs...

[traviswells.livejournal.com]

That particular design of cruiser never shows up again, does it? I'm assuming it's supposed to be an old model

Yeah, JMS said that it was an old design, which is why we don't see anymore.

[imhilien.livejournal.com]

I noticed this time that the 'big-ass slicing laser' reminded me of how Shadow ships blew up things. Funny how you spot things on repeat viewings you never really took in the first time. :-p

Hmm... perhaps the original builders observed the Shadows and managed to reverse engineer their tech. That could explain why the Great Machine is *five miles down*. Paranoia, or having a good reason to remain as hidden as possible...

Now, how could you doubt Vorlon tech as not being safe... Vorlons are angelic, you know. :-p

[4thofeleven.livejournal.com]

I thought we saw one or two in... can't remember where exactly, but I'm sure a couple showed up in the Earth Alliance civil war...

[vjs2259.livejournal.com]

I finally got the chance to sit down and watch this last night. Londo's parts are wonderful here; I particularly liked the hokey-pokey sequence. Though I wonder if we all will still be singing it in 2258...

Little things that caught my eye/ear--
Delenn telling Sinclair 'Evolution is overrated.' The Shadows are proponents of evolution through conflict.
Some Minbari go walkabout at the end of their lives. JMS says that is what happened to Delenn; that she left to 'find Valen' at the end of her life and was never seen again.
As noted above, the fact that Varn didn't reach out to Delenn. She's not ready to face self-sacrifice yet.
The parallel between Delenn not telling Sinclair they were going down to E3 with Varn and her not telling Sheridan about Anna. She chooses for Sinclair, protecting him from making a decision that will interfere with his 'true destiny'. At this point she only knows he has part of Valen's soul--how does she know what his destiny is meant to be? Part of her arrogance in S1. Also her caution. She's there to watch, not act, although that's about to change.
And she always ends up watching people she cares for make the sacrifice; watching them walk away--Draal, Sinclair, and finally Sheridan (twice). Hard to always be the one left behind.

What was the time the Great Machine was waiting for; when it would be right for others to use it? I don't think it got involved in the Shadow War except as a back-up. Varn mentioning that he'd been watching them is echoed later by Draal when he meets Sheridan. I thought that Varn managed a lot of expression through what had to be a lot of latex, especially in the end scene. I wonder if PsiCorp has marked Garibaldi from this moment, as someone with investigatory capabilities that might come in useful later.

I could go on, but I have to leave for work! I still very much like the interior of E3; nicely done with the minimal CGI available at the time. The weapon is Shadow-like but I thought it seemed more Vorlonish with the crystals on the landing pad, and the colored lights. The purple webbing on the walls (circuitry) reminded me a bit of Shadow-tech (the implants on the telepaths) and of course the whole idea of a living being needed to be the 'heart' of the Machine is very Shadow-y. Also Vorlonish too though, considering their ships sing.
Someone asked about the Zathri; maybe they were in all the elevators, rushing up and down fixing things!

[alexcat.livejournal.com]

This episode was the 'here we go into the arc' episode. It really began to set things up, at least for us. Sinclair's destiny, Garibaldi's destiny, the Mars revolution and more.

I loved the trio of Delenn, Draal and Londo taking Varn back to the planet. Londo's little ship was so fancy and so purple! Londo shone in this episode with the best lines and with his actually doing something for someone else for once.

Overall, onwe of the better season 1 eps.

[beatrice_otter]

It's the Great Machine that handles the rift in spacetime that lets them go get Babylon 4 and go back to the last Shadow War, which altered the balance of power. If that had not happened, the Shadow War B5 faced would have been a lot nastier. And shorter, in the bad way.

[vjs2259.livejournal.com]

I guess I wasn't thinking about something that...detached? abstract? Sorry, the words are not coming out right this morning!

So do you think Draal knew that would be the Machine's role when he gave the warning at the end of this episode? Or was he just aware that there would be something coming up that the Machine would do?

I love all the 'who knew what when' components of this story. Throw in the time travel storylines and I'm a happy girl.

[shapinglight]

Not much to add. Just wanted to leave a comment to show I'm still watching, and hope to do a little better next time.

An awful lot of relevant stuff set up in this episode and some great lines for Londo. His explanation of the reason why Centauri and Narn are doomed to hate each other is priceless.

[beatrice_otter]

I have no idea when Draal would have known. He very well may have.