"Legacies" discussion [spoilers]

[ruuger]

This is the discussion post for the episode 1X17, "Legacies". Spoilers for the whole of the series, including the spin-offs and tie-ins, are allowed here so newbies beware.

Summary:

Neroon and Delenn fight over the body of a Minbari war leader while Ivanova and Talia argue about the future of a 14-year-old telepath.

Extra reading:

The article for "legacies" at Lurker's Guide.

Comments

[kel-1970.livejournal.com]

Well, I don't think I can put it better than anyone else already has here: it's a great episode for S1, but has many of the flaws common to the show.

Interesting things -- well, everyone else has already mentioned these: Minbari political intrigue, commentary on many of the races, and talk about different ways telepaths are dealt with.

Had we heard, before this episode, that Narns don't have telepaths? Wait, was that in "The Gathering?" Yes, that's it.

I have to get my two cents in about REALLY loving seeing Delenn's sneaky side. I mean, really sneaky! She did a number on Neroon, and manipulated the hell out of pretty much everyone else too. IMO that's the single most pleasing thing about this episode.

I was actually wondering if, when Alyssa was "peeking" in Delenn's mind (which Delenn obviously knew was happening) if Delenn possibly gave her a "suggestion" to go with the Minbari option. That was my read on why Alyssa might have chosen Minbar. Anyone? Bueller? Anyone? (OK, just dated myself there.)

I totally agree with 4thofeleven (sorry, I don't know how to put in those nifty icons in a comment) on the inherent dissonance between the fact that telepathy is an inborn trait vs. the claim that telepathy is a "calling" on MInbar. Very problematic.

One final thing I really enjoy about rewatching S1 is hearing how differently Mira Furlan "does" Delenn's accent and speech patterns. In S1, there is much more to Delenn's ways of pronouncing English consonants than can be accounted for by a Serbo-Croatian accent. In later seasons, these characteristics are damped down quite a bit. I'll keep an ear open for whether it happens gradually, or whether it happens all at once post-metamorphosis.

[widsidh.livejournal.com]

...telepathy is an inborn trait vs. the claim that telepathy is a "calling" on Minbar.

I don't think it is "versus".
What is meant I believ is that those who are born as telepaths are led (by society) to see this as a calling, to which they will then dedicate their lives.
Says a lot about Minbari Society, IMHO, and not all good; quite in keeping with the tenets of a caste system, and also with some other observations made here recently.

BTW, did I hear a reference to *two* Minbari castes a few episodes ago, or was I dreaming that?

[4thofeleven.livejournal.com]

Yes, in "Grail", Lennier says that there are two Minbari castes, the religious and the warrior, which implies that he doesn't consider the workers relevant in a description of Minbari society or culture... Understandable; they don't seem to play any role in shaping Minbari policy - we've never heard about what their position on the Earth-Minbari war was, for example...

I always thought it a shame we never got a major Worker-caste character, get an idea of just how happy they are to be in what is clearly a subservient role compared to the other two castes, which seem to be on more of an equal footing. I always thought it was significant that we never hear of someone switching castes either to or from the Worker-caste.

[vjs2259.livejournal.com]

"which implies that he doesn't consider the workers relevant in a description of Minbari society or culture."

Or that JMS hadn't made up the three caste structure yet.

They are certainly equal members of the Grey Council by S2.

[widsidh.livejournal.com]

It's so explicit, I think JMS changed his mind before season 2...

[vjs2259.livejournal.com]

We're used to thinking he had it all planned out, but the plans did change. Without the worker caste, you had to have either the religious or warrior caste 'win' or battle to a draw. This gave him his elegant 'out' of S4.

[widsidh.livejournal.com]

Yes, in "Grail"

Oh thanks, I watched a few all in one go late a night and got confused...

Interesting in this light how things turn out for the workers in S4 then :-)
Definitely an advance from not existing...

I agree, it's a shame we never properly meet one.

[wychwood]

(sorry, I don't know how to put in those nifty icons in a comment)

If you're talking about linking the name as 4thofeleven rather than just 4thofeleven, it's a really easy bit of LJ markup: you just type
< lj user="username"> (without the space after the first bracket). So < lj user="kel_1970"> will show up as kel_1970.

There's a FAQ page that explains it here, and a more general one on how to do things like links here - handy to bookmark and keep around!